Tags
darkness, eternal fire, heaven, hell, John Calvin, light, Peter Ustinov, unbelief
- What is HELL like?
http://orig03.deviantart.net/545d/f/2013/156/6/b/heaven_or_hell_by_chronos73-d67xd75.jpg
“I imagine hell like this: Italian punctuality, German humour and English wine.”
― Peter Ustinov
A funny quote, indeed, yet what pictures do really come up in our minds when we hear someone talking about “hell”? I need to admit that I don’t know much about that fiery pit, not more than the Bible teaches. During the past centuries the Roman Catholic part of my family, my ancestors, had been threatened by the church that they would go to hell if they had committed severe sins that were not confessed before a priest. Note, Roman Catholic belief was that only members of their church could get to heaven back then since non-Catholics would be considered as heretics who would have no access to God – ever. Thank God, times have changed…
However, I just found an excerpt by John Calvin which I believe is VERY challenging. I won’t tell you before what I think about it. Instead, I am eager to know your thoughts which you could share with me right away in the comments section below.
12. Moreover, as language cannot describe the severity of the divine vengeance on the reprobate, their pains and torments are figured to us by corporeal things, such as darkness, wailing and gnashing of teeth, inextinguishable fire, the ever-gnawing worm (Mt. 8:12; 22:13; Mark 9:43; Isa. 66:24). It is certain that by such modes of expression the Holy Spirit designed to impress all our senses with dread, as when it is said, “Tophet is ordained of old; yea, for the king it is prepared: he has made it deep and large; the pile thereof is fire and much wood; the breath of the Lord, like a stream of brimstone, does kindle it,” (Isa. 30:33). As we thus require to be assisted to conceive the miserable doom of the reprobate, so the consideration on which we ought chiefly to dwell is the fearful consequence of being estranged from all fellowship with God, and not only so, but of feeling that his majesty is adverse to us, while we cannot possibly escape from it.
For, first, his indignation is like a raging fire, by whose touch all things are devoured and annihilated. Next, all the creatures are the instruments of his judgment, so that those to whom the Lord will thus publicly manifest his anger will feel that heaven, and earth, and sea, all beings, animate and inanimate, are, as it were, inflamed with dire indignation against them, and armed for their destruction. Wherefore, the Apostle made no trivial declaration, when he said that unbelievers shall be “punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power,” (2 Thess. 1:9). And whenever the prophets strike terror by means of corporeal figures, although in respect of our dull understanding there is no extravagance in their language, yet they give preludes of the future judgment in the sun and the moon, and the whole fabric of the world.
Hence unhappy consciences find no rest, but are vexed and driven about by a dire whirlwind, feeling as if torn by an angry God, pierced through with deadly darts, terrified by his thunderbolts and crushed by the weight of his hand; so that it were easier to plunge into abysses and whirlpools than endure these terrors for a moment. How fearful, then, must it be to be thus beset throughout eternity! On
this subject there is a memorable passage in the ninetieth Psalm: Although God by a mere look scatters all mortals, and brings them to naught, yet as his worshippers are more timid in this world, he urges them the more, that he may stimulate then, while burdened with the cross to press onward until he himself shall be all in all.
END OF BOOK THREE.
(John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion (1559), Book 3, Chapter 25, Section 12.)
Read more here http://www.ccel.org/ccel/calvin/institutes.v.xxvi.html
“Hence unhappy consciences find no rest, but are vexed and driven about by a dire whirlwind, feeling as if torn by an angry God, pierced through with deadly darts, terrified by his thunderbolts and crushed by the weight of his hand; so that it were easier to plunge into abysses and whirlpools than endure these terrors for a moment.”
I think that Calvin wrote this diatribe totally without any anointing, to be honest with you. It sound like something written by a ancient Greek philosopher.. Thor throwing lightning bolts at the poor creatures on the earth, etc… not by the God of all mercy who sent His Son to save us from our sins.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Yes, Michael, it could have been the influence of an ancient Greek philosopher or of Dante Alighieri’s “Inferno”… who knows. 🙄
LikeLiked by 1 person
Well regardless of the surety of there really being a hell or not-from Calvins description it sure does not sound like a place to want to hang out in for eternity.
LikeLiked by 3 people
That was very well, said, Ken. …. So true! 😉
LikeLiked by 1 person
Oh my, that is a heavy subject indeed and difficult to provide a brief response to. I think what is sometimes forgotten is that there is an enemy that wishes us harm. We have a Redeemer, protection we can avail ourselves of, but outside of His hedge of protection, there is no mercy and we are toast. We are literally in the hands of an enemy. What little I do know of such dark things is envy,hatred, and unbelievable condemnation, condemnation that makes the simple condemnation and hurts of humans seem almost meaningless and silly. It is not all bad, when one gets a peek at evil, people are no longer scary. What can a person possibly do to me, you’re just a person! And death, death is nothing, there are things much worse than death.
I truly believe that God wishes that all should prosper, that all should be saved and He’s willing to move heaven and Earth to do it. He came down to Earth and He died for us. I think that many of our people descriptions of hell and our fiery horror stories of potential condemnation are more motivated by human will than by God’s will. Generally we are trying to manipulate human behavior and control people, rather then truly inform them about the truth. It’s not hell so much that we should be concerned about, but rather having to face the enemy without an army of protection around us.
LikeLiked by 4 people
Wow!!! Awesome comment, Gabrielle! ⭐ Thank you! 🙂
LikeLiked by 1 person
You wrote: ” I think that many of our people descriptions of hell and our fiery horror stories of potential condemnation are more motivated by human will than by God’s will. Generally we are trying to manipulate human behavior and control people, rather then truly inform them about the truth. “
I have been wrestling with all that I have e “thought” about hell. Meaning, everything I have heard and/or taken in without much of my own personal thought or lately, prayer on it. Then a circumstance closed in that has given me no place for easy explanation. (Too long to get into, and too private as well), but the God I am coming to know, the God who has been faithfully revealing Himself to me, doesn’t add up to the words I’ve heard from humans. Anyway, what you wrote there means a lot to me at this present spot in my journey. Thank you!
LikeLiked by 4 people
I am glad Gabrielle’s explanation was helpful for you too, dear Becky! 🙂
You are right, there is no easy explanation possible. I had some spiritual revelations about hellish “life” before (i.e. several encounters with Satan & Co.), but I could not say that I now “know” what it is like. But what I do know today is that the absence of God’s overhelming love would be torment enough for me. And I also know that I do not want to live in the devil’s presence for only one short moment since that is horrible, indeed.
LikeLiked by 5 people
Very well said. 🙂
LikeLiked by 2 people
BESIDES WHAT REVELATION SAY ABOUT HORRIBLE THINGS : CALVIN
MENTIONED THE “HELL IS THE ABSENCE OF GOD. WE CAN GET A LITTLE
ABOUT THIS BEFORE WE WERE CHRISTIAN. ANOTHER WAY WE CAN
EXPERIENCE DIS COMFORT IS TO CONSIDER DARKNESS IS ABSENCE OF
LIGHT ( MANY CHILDREN ARE AFRAID OF THE DARK. NEXT, COLD IS THE
ABSENCE OF HEAT.. WE HAVE TO DEAl WITH THE DEVIL WITH OUR CARNAL
MAN. BUT, WHEN WE OVERCOME HIM WHEN LIVING BY THE SPIRIT OF
GOD, THEN WE CAN REMEMBER THAT JESUS DEFEATED HIM IN THE
WILDERNESS. EVEN, JOHN IN 1ST JOHN 3 VS V8, “HE WHO SINS IS OF THE DEVIL., FOR THE DEVIL HAS SINNED FROM THE BEGINNING FOR THIS
PURPOSE THE SON OF GOD WAS MANIFESTED, THAT HE MIGHT DESTROY
THE WORKS OF THE DEVIL!”
As far as I can remember: THE ONLY THING ABOUT HELL WITH JESUS
WAS THE STORY OF THE RICH MAN AND THE BEGGAR. LAZARUS WHO
HAD TO DEAL COMPLETELY COVERED WITH SORES.. BOTH DIED AND
THE RICH MAN ENDED IN HADES, POOR LAZARUS WENT TO ABRAHAM’S
BOSOM BY ANGELS. The rrich man was TORMENTED there but RECOGNIZED
ABRAHAM. SO, H E CRIED TO ABRAHAM TO SEND LAZURUS TO HELP HIM
HIM SINCE HE WAS TORMENTED IN THIS FLAME. If you wish you can
read about it in Luke 16 vs 19– 31 I will add that :THERE IS A GREAT GULF
BEWEEN HADES AND ABRAHAM’S BOSOM (heaven) SUCH THAT ONE
CANNOT PASS ONE TO THE OTHER.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Dear Bernie, as I wrote in my reply to Becky, the absence of God is unimaginably cruel if you have come to know His love before. Thinking about that being ETERNAL at that… I cannot imagine how terrible this would be… To be honest, I cannot say that in me pre-Christian life it had ever been that horrible as I experienced the devil’s freezingly cold and horrible presence for some time in the past. I guess Jesus wanted to display the difference between His freedom and loving presence and its frightening counterpart to me. Bernie, that is nothing I had ever experienced before and I do not want to get there. But I also know we are secure in God’s hands and we won’t get there – ever.
LikeLiked by 3 people
This reminded me of the fiery sermon by Puritan minister, Jonathan Edwards, “Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God.” At the time the sermon was given, worshipers were so terrified they collapsed in the aisles. The sermon is now studied as literature in schools, and ridiculed for its “exaggerated” language and images.
These days, if we concede the existence of a god at all, we prefer to view him as an understanding and forgiving sort of guy — someone either too distant to be concerned about our few foibles or willing to give us the benefit of the doubt. Former Evangelical preacher Rob Bell (“Love Wins”) teaches the heresy that hell is inconsistent with a loving God. Even televangelists like Joyce Meyer, who acknowledge the existence of hell, can mangle the concept. See, https://carm.org/joyce-meyer.
But Edwards was right. God — the One and only God Almighty — cannot tolerate sin. If He could, Salvation would not have been necessary. “For a fire is kindled in My anger, and shall burn to the lowest hell…” (Deut. 32: 22). “The wicked shall be turned into hell, and all the nations that forget God” (Ps. 9: 17). “Hell and destruction are before the Lord; so how much more the hearts of the sons of men” (Prov. 15: 11). “Hell from beneath is excited about you, to meet you at your coming; it stirs up the dead for you…” (Is. 14: 9). “And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell” (Matt. 10: 28).
It is sin, not hell, that is inconsistent with God’s nature. Recognition of that fact drives home all the more the great love God required for Salvation.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Yes, you are absolutely right, Anna, salvation without the possiblity to go to hell would make no sense at all. If, like Bell and other liberals say, hell did not exist and universalism were true, what the hell would the incarnation of God in Christ, His death, resurrection, and ascension mean? Not that much, I am afraid, since who needed to be saved then and from WHAT? This liberal branch of Christianity springs from mere human wisdom, from men and women who cannot imagine our God as HE really is. In these cases only a revelation of the Living God where His love and the fear of Him can be felt simultaneously would be of great help, I believe.
I know that God does not tolerate sin. As great as His love is, somehow I understand Him. When someone offends us, i.e. sins against us, do we like it? Can we say, “Oh, that was very good, go on with it!” No, we can’t do that. Basically, in our hearts we all know what is right and what is wrong for it was God who created them with that knowledge no human being will ever be able to deny, as we can read here for instance,
“He has made everything beautiful in its time. Also, he has put eternity into man’s heart, yet so that he cannot find out what God has done from the beginning to the end.” (Eccl 3:11 ESV)
“For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus.” (Rom 2:14-16 ESV)
Also, Anna, I do agree that the Old Testament offers a lot of Scriptures regarding hell and the eternal consequences for the unrepentant sinner. Not really fun to read them, but necessary to know about, I believe.
LikeLiked by 4 people
Liberal preachers are humanists in clerical clothing like the “wolf in sheep’s clothing.” Knowingly or unknowingly, they tend to draw people away from the Lord, rather than closer to Him.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Lloyd, you said,
“Knowingly or unknowingly, they tend to draw people away from the Lord, rather than closer to Him.”
Alas, yes. 😦 But isn’t it is the same with the other extreme, with those who constantly preach “the Law” and frighten people to ever draw near to a God who seems to love punishing them for every failure? Biblical balance is needed in both cases, I believe.
LikeLiked by 3 people
“Alas, yes. 😦 But isn’t it is the same with the other extreme, with those who constantly preach “the Law” and frighten people to ever draw near to a God who seems to love punishing them for every failure? “
I have met many of them and you know by my other comments on other blog entries that those people do not help me but cause great harm for me.
I have gotten so confused on so many things. I am not even sure if Salvation can be lost. Some think it can while others think it can not.
LikeLike
I think endless theological discussions and controversy are not really helpful, Fred, since they can keep us confused and busy in our own minds. However, God wants to give us His rest, instead. Seeking God is something that does not necessarily happen while reading what others believe about Him although God might give us some insights time and again.
LikeLiked by 1 person
In other words, Fred, salvation is not a head thing, but is a matter of the heart. Jesus is coming back for a bride that in madly in love with Him… end of story!
LikeLiked by 2 people
I like the way you said that, Michael. It made me smile.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Good comments, Anna. I recently blogged a message entitled, “It’s shocking that sin no longer shocks.” Read it at lloydstebbins.com You”ll appreciate the message.
LikeLike
That’s right, Susanne, but Paul railed against legalism in the Book of Galatians. Jesus said, “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.” The overarching message of the New Covenant, especially as applied to salvation, is one of grace as an outpouring of God’s infinite love. The incomparable sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross takes care of salvation. But by His own words leaves much of the laws of the Old Covenant in tact. We follow God’s laws or commandments, not to achieve salvation, but to grow nearer to Him. He has already expressed His infinite love for us by paying the ultimate sacrifice. Obedience is the way we express our love for Him and at the same time grow in character.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Yes, Lloyd. Basically it is so simple: someone who loves with the love of God because of having been perfected by Christ’s Spirit in them will automatically fulfill the law, here the Ten Commandments. But we need God both to write His law on our hearts and to give us the power through His Holy Spirit so that we can truly obey Him.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Now, about heaven: Andrew Culverwell’song” IF I SHOULD LIVE ON FOREVER, YOU’LL MAKE IT HEAVEN FOR ME! JUST TO BE NEAR YOU SEEING YOUR FACE CONSTANTLY!….HEAVEN IS WHERE YOU ARE AND THATS WHERE I BELONG! …I’VE HEARD ALOT ABOUT HEAVEN! ONE THING I KNOW TO BE TRUE! HEAVEN FOR ME IS WHEN I CAN BE CLOSE TO YOU!” You probably heard this: “this is heaven on earth.”
LikeLiked by 2 people
Oh yes, Bernie, heaven is where God is and if God was in hell too, we would go there as well, right? 😉
LikeLiked by 2 people
FOR 50 +YRS: I HAVE READ ABOUT NEAR DEATH EXPERIENCES. I WISH THAT
I COULLD RECALL THE SPECIFICS. MANY EXPERIENCED SUCH PEACE THAT
DID NOT WANT GO BACK TO EARTH. I THINK THAT I REMEMBER SOME
EXPERIENCED A BRIGHT LIGHT. “IN HEAVEN” NO SUN FOR GOD WILL BE THE
LIGHT!”
A SANDI PATTI SONG: SHINE DOWN YOUR LIGHT ON ME: LET THE PEOPLE SEE: THATS IN YOUR PRESENCE DARKNESS FLEES! FATHER OF LIGHTS
SHINE DOWN ON ME!” JAMES 1 V 17
LikeLiked by 1 person
Not sure whether you read about my NDE too, Bernie? If not, here’s the link https://enteringthepromisedland.wordpress.com/2014/06/13/my-testimony/.
Yes, I didn’t want to go back, either. I had even forgotten my whole family and that earth existed!! Only for a short time, of course. And for a longer time afterwards, I struggled with sadness because I could not get there on my own again. 😦
I just decided to copy and paste the excerpt of my NDE which is part of MY TESTIMONY on here, too.
At Christmas in the year of 1998, I was lying in bed because I had been seriously ill. Physical pain all over, particularly in the head region rendered sleep an impossible thing to do. And thus I was praying all night long. Notwithstanding the pain, I would become overjoyed while praying to Jesus. It was far more joy than I had ever experienced before, and I gratefully confessed to Him, “Lord, what if Your glory didn’t exist?”
Unexpectedly, I saw Him – in my own spirit – on the right side standing beside me. He was smiling and said, “I am going to show you now how much you have seen of my glory so far.”
As I was still wondering about this mysterious statement, I felt a great power drawing me quickly out of my body. Catapulted through a huge dark and empty storehouse of sorts, I was moving head first toward a mini-bay in a distant wall which limited the building. Behind that hole in the wall there was some light to be seen. But it looked like a pocket flashlight compared with the dark room I had still been in.
Suddenly, I felt that I had left the huge room. High speed was over. And I found myself behind the “pocket flashlight”, which was a short channel I had just been slipping through. Now I was placed in a vertical position, not having any ground underneath my feet and no heaven above.
Only Light.
And Love.
Pure bliss – and no pain any more.
After a few seconds or maybe a few minutes, I don’t know exactly, the whole event was over, and I was drawn feet first back into my own body, that is, into the dark storehouse with its pocket flashlight experiences.
That experience was a so-called NDE, a near death experience, as you might know.
LikeLiked by 2 people
I am not a fan of John Calvin, but there is definitely a hell for people who reject Christ in this life. Jesus speaks much on hell in the four Gospels.
The Death of Voltaire
https://hitchhikeamerica.wordpress.com/2013/12/30/the-death-of-voltaire/
LikeLike
I read the link you shared, Tim, and I decided to let God be the judge of Voltaire and other ‘infidels’. As for me, I have often been angry at God and so I understand Voltaire’s reactions to a certain degree. I chose to repeat two questions apostle Peter once raised,
For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God? And “If the righteous is scarcely saved, what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?” (1 Pt 4:17-18 ESV)
The path that leads to life is much narrower than I ever thought and I can only feel deep compassion when I read such a sad testimony. That could have been my story, too. But by God’s grace, I might be saved.
LikeLiked by 1 person